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Tuesday, November 22, 2005

It's "Shver" To Be A "Shver"- The Tale Of The Scumbag Son In-Law

TRUE STORY:WELCOME BACK R' GROSS
Just returned from a very important assignment in HUD country
.


”Schnorrer,” has been married four years and has 3 children in diapers. (In fact, several weeks after he was first allowed to touch his tired wife, after a C-section produced child #2 , she was already pregnant with the third.)

Desperate to marry his aging 21 year old daughter, four years ago, Schnorrers’s shver (father in law) agreed to support Schnorrer in the amount of $1000 per month as long as he was in kollel. It was understood that Schnorrer will go out to work after a few years. Schnorrer is quite capable of working; he is rather quick with numbers as you will soon see.

So what is the problem? Recently, Schnorrer, having a head for figures, made a quick calculation on his way to a 10 AM shacharis, You see, he is facing a dilemma, whether or not he has to work. That calculation went as follows:

Background:

A recent job prospect offered a generous starting salary of $30,000 ( remember, absolutely no education or experience!) after several weeks of Cope training (Don’t praise the Agudah just yet, but if you must then take a few moments to do just that…)

OPTION 1

+++Shver pays him $1000 per month ($12k/annually)

+++Schnorrer schnors $700/month from mother, a professional, who was coerced into paying his Lakewood tuition she paid for him as a bochur, directly to him now (which is no longer due to the Yeshiva because of his newly attained matrimonial status, rendering him scot-free from tuition. Another instance of singles being discriminated against by the thugs who run our religion)

+ ++ Hundreds of dollars per month in the form of government handouts ranging from rent to groceries, most of which he will lose once gainfully employed.

OPTION 2

+++Go to work and earn the same amount of money.

“Why work?” he said. I’m better off not working and getting (I nearly slapped him) the same amount of money. Besides both my shver and mother are getting tremendous mitzvos for supporting me while I learn!”


This is not a unique situation. Schnorrer is not alone! Yungerleit that never held jobs and collect money in the form of WIC, HUD, etc.... are purchasing homes under their shver's name and "renting" it to themselves and having the govt pay their rent! PURE THEFT. Others invest in Lakewood real estate to become slum lords. They rent houses to families of Mexicans, polluting the very demographic they have created.
Oh, that’s right it’s the “treife newspapers” and Internet that are to blame for all the tragedies. Go ahead and justify it! “It’s “hefker” anyway, the shvartzes do it so why can’t we?” So you’re comparing yourselves to these lower forms of humanity – that’s one step in the right direction!

When will it stop? This type of “economy” cannot sustain itself. It is impossible! A generation of schnorrers is trying to breed another generation of even bigger schnorrers (these new schnorrers won’t have working parents with money.) There will be a spiritual rebellion. Many Lakewood kids are messed up already! The ones who have zero interest in learning have even less of an interest in attaining a secular education that might enable them to live a decent life. These idiots aren’t going into any decent business either (except for the occasional “mortgage guy“.)

So get ready to sit back and observe the community that will implode and self-destruct in 10-15 years (if even that long) when the well runs dry and the kids have “had it.” Prepare to watch. And laugh. Don’t say we haven't warned you!

93 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

refreshing rant, poor fathers and in-laws.

Tuesday, November 22, 2005 11:43:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You see ,uoj, your blaming the wrong person.This "Shnora" is not to blame, he was raised a shnora and a
shnora he has become. He is a product of his upbringing. His mother never instilled in him a sense of resposibility, she did not want to upset the genious. His rabbayim told him that to work for
a living was "evil", and beneath his dignity. They also did not teach him what it means to be an honest erlicher yid. His fatherin law allowed his daughter to fall into the hands of someone with the shnora mantality, and encouraged it by supporting a person who halachcally should be supporting his wife himself. People should start reading their ketubas, its facinating reading. His poor wife was taught that to marry an earner and learner was wrong so she just follwed along.This shnora is just
behaving like he was conditioned to behave. He also probably thinks his a gadol hador who can't even posken a simple question in halacha as long as he knows how to
turn his thumb in the right direction, and show how clever he is. I honestly think hes not to blame. His mother, rabayim, fatherin law have created a shnora.
He only knows how to be one, nothing more so why blame him.Hes like a small child lost in an adult world. I feel sorry for him.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 12:01:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anonymous above is right. This guy is given a wife and money, why should he change? It would be stupid for him to. Hes got it made.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 12:16:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

why do rich people chafe against supporting toireh lishmah? Do they want to lose their oilam haba?

You want everyone to be a zvulun?

Blame Reb Elchonon Wasserman and the rosehei yeshiva of Telshii if you want to, but how can you tell anyone not to sit and learn? As they will tell you, without their Toireh the world would be destroyed.

Wasting time and other people's money is part of the yeshiva experience.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 12:26:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

WE have to make a distinction between a fraud whose claiming to be a kollel man , and the real thing. I have only admoration for the person that strives to be great in torah. He knows he will have to live a simple life, and learns . He learns halacha so that klal yisreal can have a person to posken questions for them. He doesn't feel that hes entitled.
Hes not a shnora but an honest hard working person.However you've got the other guy who feels that hes entitled. Hes mediocre in learning,has never really put in a full day at kollel and wants to be supported. Hes a fraud and needs to find employment. The other guy should be supported because we need him to learn. But the other leach is taking money which should be going to the real thing.Some body told the leach thats its fashionable to be in kollel so hes in kollel.Hes a fraud and is draining precious resources.Lets get real.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 12:45:00 AM  
Anonymous the booger said...

anonymous;

What planet are you, pal? You are full of pure USDA grade-A shit.

Put the blame where it belongs; with some of these rosh yeshivas who push for their charges to get ad infinitum support Ad Meah Ve'asrim. Otherwise you don't marry the girl, kapish? So what is Papa and Shver to do? They're being held hostage. Some of These Yungerleit strut around like peacocks thinking they're G-d's gift to Torah and true-blue yiddishkeit. Go into Boro Park any morning and watch these grossly obese yungerleit waddling down the street at 11 AM to Schacharis, followed by a leisurely high-calorie breakfast and a few smokes. Maybe open a Sefer for a few minutes and then hey, it's time for lunch! Disgraceful!

I was at a Lakewood Sheva Brochos recently and was shocked and astounded to hear the Chosen get up to speak and stress the importance of sitting and learning long-term and criticize "Baalabatim" for not knowing the true meaning of Torah and setting aside long stretches of time during the day to learn. What a public slap in the face to his Shver who was sitting right next to this "wonderful" Chosen and turned white like the tablecloth.

This Shver who gets up at 5 AM every morning to learn a Seder and then puts in 12-14 hours at his job. I was really tempted to punch this punks lights out. And don't think this punk is an isolated situation. No, this is the Lakewood Brainwash at work.

How many of these punks do you know that will only go out if they know that her father has got a truckload of
bucks and will support in luxury (car, house, insurance, the fancy designer suits and shoes from Emporio, the designer eyeglasses, Blackberry, Lexus, top-shelf Borsalino, monogrammed white shirts, fancy expensive cufflinks, etc, ad nauseum) for a minimum of 5 years? And if these pishers can't get the bucks, what's their fall back position? That's right, you got it...they look for a girl whose father is a Rosh Yeshiva and has a $$ interest in that Yeshiva so that within a few years they a have a ready made "job" set up for them.

R'Gross, you're on target. This Chilul Hashem is incredible. Lakewood encourages this, indeed. What is really funny (and tragic) is allowing these shmucks to buy the real estate, move in these Mexican squatters for a time to allow the property to appreciate in value, and then flip it to some hard-working family with kids who have to kill themselves to buy the house. This Lifnei EEver gouging is OK but bugs in the water, Indian wigs, and Internet is treif???? Gimmee a
break!

R' Gross, Disagree with you that it's gonna take another 10-15 years for the implosion. The implosion is going on right now in our faces...just look at the Shidduchim Crisis in our midst. Wonderful ehrliche girls can't get married because their fathers don't have the big bucks...where the hell are the Rosh Yeshivas to take charge of this crisis.

I think we both know the answer.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 8:31:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

they're at the bank?

You're not wrong about corrupt roshei yeshiva. Lakewood and the thinking that culture represents is identified with Agudath Israel, Torah true.

The difference between now and a hundred years ago is that in Europe the yeshivos were actually small, not big numbers and every crafts group had a bais medrash and chevra shas. No doubt they learned more than the fake frum kollel yungerleit. But, Rav Aharon Kotler, z'l, knew that without fake frum, there would be no strength to Torah true. He probably never imagined Lakewood would grow to current levels.

But, uoj, you can't rewrite history. They have sources to justify themselves and bitachon. Lo alman Yisrael. Those who can't take kollel, leave after twenty years.

The psychology of yeshiva guys is, I agree, totally corrupt, which is precisely why an enterprising lad would want to marry your daughter.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 9:23:00 AM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

R'Gross,
You got the Booger going, this time he's with us.
No small feat.
Rosh Yeshivas are the "Original Sin" perpetrators. They're the snakes.They suck in these kids to a culture that they know is sick, but good for their business.
These parents are truly stuck. Even the MO crowd is suffering.
Many of them are supporting their kids in this scandal because their kids "fell" in with the wrong crowd in Israel or elsewhere.
Meanwhile these choshuva kollel guys are stealing and ripping off everyone in sight.
Sickos.....

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 9:56:00 AM  
Anonymous gross said...

Funny how ALL the Rosh Yeshivas that preach Kollel, earn paychecks!

Anonymous above: Twenty years is a long time to realize "one can't take Kollel."

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 10:14:00 AM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Gross,
Earn paychecks???
They are real estate moguls.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 10:26:00 AM  
Anonymous shlomo said...

UOJ feels competiotion from the lakewood guys. Get yourself a hooker and fuck the hell out of her and calm down.

Since when did gross get smicha?

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 11:53:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I believe this is a very important topic. This chillul hashem vis-a-vis the government is worse than the chillul hashem related to other recently-discussed topics.
If you want to be a "zevulun" you must find a real "yisochor". I now throw away requests from Kollels for donations - I give the money to individual yingeleit whom I know to be honest, sincere, who sit al hatorah v'al hoavodah, and who live modest lifestyles.
Personally, I blame Agudas Yisroel for much of this chillul hashem - they are constantly lobbying and pestering the government for money, promoting their "cult" of gedolei yisroel (did you ever notice that only those following their shitos are gedolei yisroel), and promoting themselves as the only real "Torah Judaism".
PS: I don't need Shlomo's suggestion - I feel much better after a good rant.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 12:05:00 PM  
Anonymous gross said...

Very classy Shlomo.

BTW I have de facto smicha since I am a member of a choshuva mosed - isn't that how most "Rabbis" attain that title?

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 12:33:00 PM  
Anonymous the booger said...

Hey UO;

This topic gets me riled up.

You once invited me to write a blog, well there it was (above).

Good point about the Agudah, anon. Ever see who their annual man of the year is at their Dinner? Some 2-bit politician hack who has been massaged successfully by Agudah for the bucks. They recently honored a politico who was anti-Israel but came through for them with the gelt.

How do you spell Yoisher? G-E-L-T!

It's sad and incredible that these yeshiva guys learn the Sugya of "Toas Akoom" and that even if Mutar, still should return the money because of the Inyan of Chilul Hashem and Bein Adom L'Chaivero but yet have no reservation about robbing the Gov't blind with all of these bogus programs. Indded, they feel justified with the attitude that "Es Koomt Mir"

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 12:34:00 PM  
Anonymous Frum From Birth said...

UOJ,

I have been reading your blog now for weeks.

FINALLY, FINALLY, you have put up a blog that is of true substance, and for this I say kudos to you!!

This important topic cannot be stressed enough, it is already an epidemic in our society.

I am a 27 year old, Orthodox father of 3 (B"H). I was down this very road myself, as I spent the first year of my marriage in a Brooklyn Kollel and relying on my parents and in- laws for support.

Thank G-d I am now working (hard) for a living (I am a Touro grad.) and feel thankful that I can reap the rewards of my "Yegia's Capai". No longer do I have to feel like a leech when I go to sleep at night, thinking about how I am scamming my family to support my learning.

I say that the Yungerleit who are TRUE B'nai Torah SHOULD be supported. Indeed it is even a mitzvah to support these men who are holding up our world.

But, let's be honest here for a second; how many of these true B'nai Torah are there in our Kollel system? Conversely, how many of these "learners" are actually nothing more than bums and loafers seeking shelter and hiding in the idyllic surrounding of the Kollel, where they can shirk ALL of their financial, familial, and personal responsibilities behind the facade known as the "Kollel Yungerman". Unfortunately, this is all too often the case in our community...

These freaking SOB'S are the slobs that can be found by their unassuming, tapped out shvers, on any day and time of the week lurking in the coffee room, or smoking outside while they gossip about some meaningless crap. These are the same blowhards that show up at the 10 a.m. shacharis looking comatose, and long after their Shvers (whom they dismiss as "nebech" a Bal Habus") have already prayed and begun their workday.

These are the putzes whose wives are hassled and harried (and look like they are ready to pass away)with kids hanging from everywhere, and no help from the husbands who have to be in Yeshiva.

AND IF YOU NEED TO DIFFERENTIATE THESE JOKERS FROM THE TRUE B'NAI TORAH, KOLLEL YUNGERLEIT, WHO ARE THE CROWN OF OUR PEOPLE, THERE IS AN EASY WAY TO DO IT:

RE-READ THIS GREAT BLOG BY UOJ AND LOOK AT THE PSYCHO AND PERVERTED "CHESHBON" MADE BY THIS "YUNGERMAN".

ANYONE WHO MAKES THESE KIND OF CHESHBONOS IS NOT THE KIND OF PERSON WHO DESERVES TO BE SUPPORTED IN THE FRAMEWORK OF A KOLLEL. THESE ARE PRECISELY THE KIND OF FRAUDS WHO GIVE ALL YUNGERLEIT A BAD RAP IN THE FIRST PLACE..

THESE GUYS WOULD BE BETTER SERVED (AND BE A GREATER ASSET TO THE KLAL) TO WORK BEHIND THE COUNTER IN THE SAME FRESS GESHEFT THEY HANG OUT IN EVERY THURSDAY NIGHT FOR SOME CHULENT.

THESE SLOBS MAKE ME PUKE!!!

Kudos to OUJ for a great blog!!

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 12:52:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Frum From Birth,
Please tell me what what you're really thinking.
WOW- what a let it rip post!!!
Yasher Koach!!!!
The credit for this blog goes to the chairman of the UOJ board, R' Gross, he outdid himself on this one!
His and your sentiments are exactly the way we "nebach" baale batim feel.
We get ridiculed to death for going to work, and supporting these no goodnicks.
I kick every rosh yeshiva and rosh kollel out of my office and house, saying to them I WANT TO KNOW EXACTLY WHICH YUNGERMAN THE MONEY IS GOING TO.
They look at me like I'm crazy and wish me a refuah, but they keep coming back.
I sat in Lakewood last year for a week during the winter legal holiday(at their request), 35% attendance max. at any given time.
I told the Kotler boys to kiss my tuchis.
They told me it was the wrong time of the year....
Ha, pathetic thieves...they should be taken out and tarred and feathered...
They give the Ponzi scam a new meaning....

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 1:09:00 PM  
Anonymous Frum from Birth said...

Hey OUJ,

The 35% attendance you witnessed was only because you were in the wrong place.

You should have left the main Bais Hamedrash and walked outside and around to the Coffee room / dining room. You probably would have done better there....

What really gets me though, is how these sickos can shlep money from there shvers with the one hand, while stabbing them in the back with the other by talking behind there backs (sometimes it's even to their faces...) about their "Bal Habittishe Hasogois" and "Nebach....Balabatishkeit"...

It's just frigging unbelievable...spitting in the very well that gives you your sustanance...

LOL

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 1:19:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Boog,
Keep it up; score a certain amount of "no B.S. posts-points" and the board will look at your potential of becoming a board member.
Something to look forward to..

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 1:21:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Frum From Birth,
I sense new talent here......

When my girls get into the "parsha", I pity that SOB who will question me on my ability to be zoche to support him.
I will have a shotgun hanging in my living room....
I'll blow a hole in his TOP SHELF BORSALINO!(if he gets by my screeners)

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 1:25:00 PM  
Blogger Barry said...

Ha, Ha ! UO:

2 comments:

1. Forget the No B.S. points. Gimmee something of value like I wanna become a Kollel Yungerman. Will you support me? Please?

2. Having the shotgun hanging from the wall will do you no good and be too late, these guys have fast hands. Keep it in a holdster; and remember to protect your beitzim by wearing a steel jock

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 1:48:00 PM  
Anonymous the booger said...

sign me up.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 1:52:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

the twenty year figure was taken from someone i know who learned in lakewood for twenty years, learned to hate lakewood, went out to make millions and never gave lakewood a penny afterwards.

the kotler boys are each a piece of work, the businessman and the fake.

But, in their defense they mail out a well designed sefiras ha-oimer chart every year, and for this klal yisroel owes them bigtime.

Rabbi Neuberger, uoj, built up a kollel with 120 or so. Representing the Agudah, he shared those values. His kids run that family business, but you don't complain.

a chink in your armor from wearing a steel jock?

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 1:57:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Above Anon..,

I understand where you are coming from.
Do you know out of all the kollelim, Ner Yisroel has the strictest admissions policy?
I know people that were turned down,(no $ fom the yeshiva), and people who were nicely asked to leave.
Kollel is not their BUSINESS, that's the difference.
BTW, Aron Feldman is NOT a member of the family.
Sheftel could have been made Rosh Yeshiva, he's more qualified than Feldman any day.
The yeshiva is in ehrliche hands, and the Neuberger boys are a chip off the old block...very capable and have yiras shomayim...
My prediction for the next rosh yeshiva is......
stay tuned.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 2:37:00 PM  
Anonymous Frum from Birth said...

Hey OUJ,

First off, I don't wanna be your "new talent". I just want to vent some of these pent up frustrations now that you have given me the opportunity!

Also, I must say that again, you underestimate these shlubs. Put the shotgun away because you won't be blowing away any of these "eligible bochurim".

NO, they do not even have the cajones to ask the prospective shver directly for full time support. If they did, it would be "halb t'zoris", because at least then you would have the opportunity to salm the SOB...AND THAT IS PRECISELY WHAT THEY ARE SCARED OF. They don't want a confrontation and/or debate, because they thrive off their mediocrity and wouldn't know what the hell to answer against your tirade.

No...they definitely wont sully their own hands...

Instead, they get the Drek Shadchante to up the ante by bringing in the full time support thing with you and your wife, often putting you on the spot with remarks like.. "don't you want a good bochur for your daughter" ...or ^%&*%$# like that.

These guys don't have the balls to ask you for your money, for if they did, they would go out and earn some of their own damned cash.

Oh... and for the guy before who commented on the financial obligation of every husband based on the contractual writing in the Kesubah.....

Do you actually think that these "bochurim" know what the hell is written in the Kesubah, that they should feel some type of responsibility to get off their duff????

You must be kidding me!

The only thing these slobs pay attention to in the kesubah is that she is indeed a "BESULAH"!!

The rest is just semantics....

I goota sign off now before I puke just thinking about these bums.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 2:48:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

FFB,
You are giving me a good idea for a future blog; CHICKEN SOUP FOR THE SHVER....A list of do's and dont's...
There are no guarantess in life, a parent can do the best they can and hope for the best.
I'm doing the best I can in bringing up my girls and boys with values that they can be proud of...

A father can send his daughter to the right school and seminary...it does not have to be Bais Yaakov of Boro Park or BJJ.
Any guy that is not in college would not get in my front door, for example.

Ultimately...hakol bedai Shomayim...but you bet your bippy I'm gonna do my homework down here.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 3:01:00 PM  
Anonymous the booger said...

Sounds like you'll be looking at YU, Ner Israel, and maybe Torah Vodaas boys. Not bad. YU puts out good stock. R' Herschel Schacter and R' Yonason Sacks are the real deal.

Would you be comfortable with a guy who wears a Kippah Serugah? How would that go down on the streets of Flatbush and B.P.?

Insofar as chicken soup; forget it. You'll need stronger stuff.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 3:24:00 PM  
Anonymous the booger said...

UO;

As far as a list of do's and don'ts: Will not work unless and until all prospective shvers band together in a union and proclaim to the shadchan's and shadchantes:

"NOT TAKING THIS BULLSHIT, NO MORE!"

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 3:26:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

uoj, you disappoint me.

you aren't as big a shot as i thought.

but, that's better for many reasons.

a blog is an inappropriate place to reveal the real truth.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 3:29:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Hey Boog,
How about you doing that blog...
Go ahead...let it rip
E-mail it to: a_unorthodoxjew@yahoo.com

This is the big test...don't be nervous now...

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 3:30:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

FFB,
BTW, did you know that ALL women are called BETULAHS, so as not to expose the ones that are not?

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 3:35:00 PM  
Anonymous the booger said...

Lemme think of a topic.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 3:40:00 PM  
Anonymous Frum from Birth said...

Yes I know... unfortunately (or fortuntely) the same benefit of the doubt given in the Loshon hakesubah is not transferred to the actual invitation, which is why you will see many that say, plain "hakalah" instead of "hakalah habesulah hamehulala". Those being the girls who went to BJJ????

Insofar as your book title, do not use the word "shver" since that is usually indicative of someone who has already been screwed...

and yes, I agree that "Hakol b'idei shamayim". Hoever, look at what chazal say next; "chutz m'yiras shamayim. This is the key element that is lacking in these species of yeshiva boys.

Their translation of yiras shamayim is $$$$$$$ ....and I kid you not...this is common knowledge...

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 4:00:00 PM  
Anonymous gross said...

Not to veer off topic but the practice of eliminating the word "Besulah" has thankfully become widespread. It took a while for the Yeshivishe people to omit this on the invitation although many still retain this archaic and immodest phrase that only serves to degrade women.

I have noticed though that when a Yeshivishe guy is marrying into a more "Balabatishe" family (for obvious rea$on$!) the word "Besulah" is not on the invitation. The other family presumably won't tolerate it.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 4:19:00 PM  
Anonymous the booger said...

Gross;

Good blog; timely and on the money (pardon the pun).

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 4:24:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

A big issue, over a little tissue.....

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 5:31:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

FFB,
From my experience in knowing a lot of people, it is safe to assume that any guy who married his daughter off to a Borsalino guy, has been screwed. Therefore a Shver has a "chezkas screwed" status.
A good Purim Torah topic would be "when would he lose that status" and if he would be "eligible" to be a rabbi in the Reform movement because of his chazaka.
This is really a teefer gedank for the lamdunim among us.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 5:41:00 PM  
Anonymous the booger said...

And the answer is UO, that he would not be appropriate to serve the Reform congregation as everyone there is engaged in a 4-letter activity:

W-O-R-K.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 6:07:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

I'm looking for a pipul on this particular chazaka as it pertains to the philosophy of accepting rabbis for Reform congregations.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 6:12:00 PM  
Anonymous gross said...

I don't understand how his "screwed status" would impact his ability/eligibility to lead a Reform Cong. Where's the "shaiches?" Pardon me I'm a bit slow today

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 6:21:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

R' Gross,
C'mon, think of the people who are eligible for the Reform "rabbinate".
This is like learning a R' Chaim, it requires deep thought.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 6:30:00 PM  
Anonymous sechel said...

There is also mofas added to the shver.
m=medicaid
vuv=velfare
f=food stamps
s=section eight(housing)

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 6:37:00 PM  
Anonymous gross said...

My mind went there immediately but I thought it was deeper than that (no pun intended)

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 6:37:00 PM  
Anonymous sechel said...

The rosh yeshivas state 'if one out of a thousand' becomes a talmid chochom that's all we care about.
The kids are indoctrinated from early on-the sad part is no gemilas chasodim-no bein adom lachavero is emphaszed.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 6:42:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Gross,
See what happens when you don't blog for a long time, you get all confused.
I hope you learn a lesson from this.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 7:17:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Sechel,
Not only is this poor guy going into hock for the chassuna for life,( yes, most guys in Brooklyn CAN NOT AFFORD TO SUPPORT THEIR KIDS-BELIEVE IT), this low-life bloodsucker son in-law is keeping this guy up at night wondering how he is going to pay the grocery bill.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 7:21:00 PM  
Blogger Shlomo said...

UOJ<
It sounds like you made the mistake of not marrying $. Leave lucky guy in Lakewood alone. It's his family's problem (z'chus) not yours!

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 8:02:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The anonymous above who stated cocerning the ketuba is right. These guys should read very carefully the ketuba. Its not their inlaws obligation to support
them, or their wives grandparents,
its theirs. How can someone sign a
document he does not understand?
also, how do we respond to the theory above that a shnara is breeded to be one?

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 8:14:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Anon..,
These guys could not care less about the ketuba...
They can't wait until the chassuna is over for one of three reasons
1-count the money
2-jump on their new toy for a few seconds.
3-a combination of the two above, counting while....

I'd be curious to know what the readers think. Please vote.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 10:08:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Hey Shlomo,
Well hello to you my wacked out shiny pants, overweight, sweaty, parisite, money grubbing former Lakewood guy, friend.

When did you leave Lakewood?

1-Your shver dropped dead of a heart attack supporting you
2-The poor guy wound up in the Nut House
3-He ran out of money and food because of you and started eating dog food without the OU.
4-Your shver started mumbling shit like he was going to kill you and every rebbe you ever had
5-He burnt your wedding album
6-The shver who was a very nice guy started beating the crap out of your shviger.

Which one Shlomo, or did it ALL happen at once????

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 10:30:00 PM  
Anonymous Benjamin said...

True Story: Happened to a Friend:

A choshuva yingerman was learning in Lakewood kollel, supported by his father in law, an accomplished businessman. After ten years of learning, the father in law told the young Talmud chocham that he did not intend to support him and his growing family forever. It was time for the choshuva Yingerman to try to support himself. The shver offered his son in law a job. He started him out in the accounting department, even though the yingerman knew nothing about accounting. After a few weeks, the yingerman came to his father in law and told him he did not think it was appropriate for a talmud chocham such as himself to work with regular people including goyim who tell dirty jokes and talk naarishkeit all day. It was affecting his neshama. So the father in law transferred the son in law to the advertising department. After a few weeks, the son in law again complained, the women in the advertising dept. don't dress tznius and so on. So the father in law transferred the talmud chocham son in law and made him manager of the shipping department. Again, after a few weeks, the same story: it is not appropriate for a Ben Torah to be in such an environment where people curse, discuss sports and other nonsense all day and so on. Exasperated the father in law said, "OK, you want to go back to kollel. Go ahead. You are useless here." "Certainly," said the son in law. " But first you have to buy me out." This guy actually thought that since he was not going to be working, his father in law should pay him his inheritance in the business!

True story!

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 10:34:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Come on Benjamin, I heard variations of this joke a thousand times.
I don't like you or anyone making fun of me.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 10:42:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Why, is the joke about you?

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 10:43:00 PM  
Anonymous the booger said...

Have a good laugh, the shvers aren't laughing. They look like shit while their Eidims are strutting around like peacocks.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 10:49:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Shnorrers breeding Shnorrers,

Think about this.

Who would Jesse Jackson & Al Sharpton be leaders of if their followers were independent and prosperous people?

The name of the game is to keep as many people as possible broke, without hope and on government programs....
They now have someone to give them hope...false hope of course!

Sound familiar kollel guys?

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 11:08:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The system as it now exists breeds cripples, people who are naive about the world, people who can not develop character because every decision is made for them as they are reduced to a life of begging without shame. And where is the great Torah scholarship this system is supposed to produce?

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 11:27:00 PM  
Anonymous the booger said...

Who was the Rosh Kollel, I believe in Toronto, that caused a firestorm when he advised one of his talmidim to marry the rich girl instead of the poor girl whose father was a Talmid Chochom from big Yichus.

This pablum they spread about Torah, Yichus, Avodah, etc is good for the Shabbos Haghodol and Shabbos Shuva Droshos but has no practical application.

The buck starts and stops at the shver.

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 11:40:00 PM  
Blogger David Kelsey said...

Gross!! Great post, I am always happy to hear analysis when it comes to irresponsible socio-economic policies in the Jewish community. And my oh my, there's no shortage in the black hat world is there?

And Shlomo! You're back too! Guess a reunion is only appropriate for the Thanksgiving season.

So Happy Thanksgiving, UOJ, Gross, and any others who read this blog and are aware that they are no longer in Poland and are happy about that fact. And don't worry, J.B. Soloveitchik "marked" Thanksgiving on some level, so we're all clear, right fellahs?

Thursday, November 24, 2005 12:53:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

so vat?

yu like turkey?

Thursday, November 24, 2005 10:10:00 AM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Feels like a class reunion.
Where's AmEchad?

Thursday, November 24, 2005 12:23:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

A jew should not eat turkey.Its against Judaism to celebrate thanks giving

Thursday, November 24, 2005 1:53:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

anyone who dresses up like an indian, a puritan, or a turkey should be thrown out of the yeshiva.

Thursday, November 24, 2005 2:17:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

When I was in Yeshiva, they took it a step further. Not only did they not serve turkey on Thanksgiving (They always served turkey on Thursdays) but they made sure not to serve a fleishige mail so as not to honor the goyishe yom tov. Such assholes.

Thursday, November 24, 2005 2:21:00 PM  
Anonymous above anonymous said...

typo correction *meal

Thursday, November 24, 2005 2:23:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

It was always funny to listen to the Yeshivish assholes mocking Thanksgiving when ya know that evening they were going to have turkey w/ their more "modern" grandparents...

Thursday, November 24, 2005 2:24:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

The yeshivish guys should just eat like they always do, eat until they stop breathing...and let the wife do the clean up.

Thursday, November 24, 2005 2:55:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

To the idiot anonymous who said Jews should not eat Turkey or celebrate a thanks giving to your host country,

YOU ARE A BIG SHMUCK!

Thursday, November 24, 2005 2:59:00 PM  
Blogger Blog World said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

Thursday, November 24, 2005 3:14:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

In the yeshiva of philadelphia they served turkey roll on thanksgiving. So there.

And their rosh yeshiva, the one with his marbles, is a tsaddik.

Thursday, November 24, 2005 3:49:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

if only the entire world were in uoj's image, how much happier and better all would be.

not a schmuck

Thursday, November 24, 2005 3:50:00 PM  
Anonymous the booger said...

To anon;

You hypocrite ass-licker. You won't eat the turkey on Thanksgiving but you'll get your nose all brown and twisted out of shape by making the goy politico your Guest of Honor at your Yeshiva's or Mosad's Annual Dinner and take the gov't goys money with both of your fat grubby hands.

Get outta my face, you low-life.

Thursday, November 24, 2005 8:49:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

what are you booger? a booger?

anyone so identified is self hating.

The politicians are just as corrupt. Why do you draw distinctions?

i guess you are fed up with lowlives getting government benefits, and you are not wrong, but observing thanksgiving with a festive meal is not a mitzvah, in fact, it takes away from Shabbos.

I observe Thanksgiving over the weekend, as do most Americans, in the mall.

Thursday, November 24, 2005 9:37:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

A Freilichen, Yasher-Koach Gayben Tug!

Thursday, November 24, 2005 9:46:00 PM  
Anonymous the booger said...

Who said anything about a mitzvah? How about Hakoras Hatov? Ever learn about that?

Takes away from Shabbos!!?? Heeew! Ha!
Gimmee a break, please! What do you know about being Mechubad the Shabbos?

You're probably one of those grossly obese red-faced slobs with your belt buckle down around your ankles one can find Thursday nights at the Take-Out fressing away at the Cholent. Toe'ahmeha Chaim Zochu, you get an early start indeed, don't you fat boy.

Do you eat on Fridays? Or do you fast from the morning so that you should have more Tay'avone and Cheishek for the Heilige Shabbos Meals? Betcha I can find you tomorrow at the Pizza Parlor at 2 PM wolfing down a few pizzas, a ziti, and a calzone.

Thursday, November 24, 2005 9:59:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Boog,

Calm down, Shabbos is coming & according to some, Moshiach is already here.(just playing hide & seek & nobody found him yet)

Thursday, November 24, 2005 10:30:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Booger, you should avoid the streets of Brooklyn at all costs. It's not good for your blood pressure.

I happen to never eat anything after hatsot and not much before.

You have a big attitude, but obviously you are repulsed by repulsive behavior and you are not wrong.

But, thanksgiving, which on occasion I have "observed" when family wished to gather, is not a mitzvah other than kibbud av v'em.

The Rav was an immigrant and as the papers reported today, immigrants take Thanksgiving seriously. See things in cultural context.

The same for the gross slobs of Borough Park. Not everyone that lives in Brooklyn is gross, not even you.

Thursday, November 24, 2005 10:48:00 PM  
Anonymous the booger said...

Sheesh, anon; I'm blushing...you telling me I'm not a "slob".

Think I'll have a T-shirt with that slogan made up for me on Sunday.

Shabbat Shalom

Thursday, November 24, 2005 10:51:00 PM  
Anonymous gross said...

Not everyone is gross...

Thursday, November 24, 2005 11:02:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

just here having some left over turkey thankfull i was not born in iran, iraq or cuba.Im sure the kotlers can open a branch of lakewood there with fidel as an honorary president.How can we honestly thank G-d that we have so much opportunities in the us?Is
turkey the only way?

Thursday, November 24, 2005 11:56:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Besides the standard prayer for the Medinas Yisroel in the MO shuls on Shabbos, does any rov or rosh yeshiva(outside the MO) ever say that we must have hakoras hatov to our country???
Never...
Forget about the turkey, this is not about the fress... for a change, we have our own fress days like every Shabbos & Yom Tov( and to Brooklynites all day every day).
I don't get it, have we become like animals....take or steal whatever we can, and tell our host F*** you???

Friday, November 25, 2005 12:13:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Too bad my inlaws could not afford to have their turkey this year. Im sure my fatherinlaw would have enjoyed it after working 50 hour weeks to provide ,me, his great
new soninlaw with the luxuries i need. The 100000 wedding with all the trimmings. My 400$ hat,10000$ rolex, and ofcoarse my brand new shas. Don't forget the 8 row silver atara over my tallit. My father in law has his same old tallit with no atara. I guess he was saving up for me his pride and joy. I have to go , have to be at minyan at 10:00am sharp while my new wife gats up at 7:00am for her new teaching job. Im glad she's working as well in addition to my inlaws support. I feel this urge for more turkey. But do'nt tell anyone,thansgiving is a treifer holiday. But i sure love the turkey
especially when my inlaws are buying it for me. It some how taste better that way.My fatherinlaw is so funny he tried talking to me in Torah the other day about something he learned at his5:30 am daf yomi, it was so balabatish. Im glad i told him how foolish his whole sevara was. You should have seen the look on his face. Its my duty to put the baalbatim in their place since im a gadol i can"t possibly engage in
Torah learning with a baalbayit.This turkey sure taste good.

Friday, November 25, 2005 12:15:00 AM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Above;
Ok- Well said!
Let us know when the old geezer gets one of the above "Shlomo six"
machlas, we'll send out the Satmar Rebbes and the Shamas and the Bikur Cholim and the chevra kadisha, because he was ZOCHE to get you as his son in-law.

Friday, November 25, 2005 12:23:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

My fatherinlaw prayed real good. Im glad i listened to my rabbayim.What more can i ask for?
Maybe a brand new car?I can't walk a couple of blocks , its bital Torah. And ofcoarse my status.I need all my friends to envy me. Isn't life grand. America sure is the land of opportunity. How can i ever repay america? I know go on welfare,hud or some other subsidy.
My fatherin law pays taxes. This is another way to squeeze the good old feller for more cash. I hope they raise his taxes.I also need my shas to be leather bound. You know its all about my status as a gadol.Im so clever. Im great.Life sure is grand in america.A brand new wife,turkey and a leather bound shas. maybe an armani suitnext.
I sure love it when my friends envy me.

Friday, November 25, 2005 12:33:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

which rosh yeshiva ever was makkir tov to america?

We are makkir tov to der Aybeshter. We ate veggies in Mitsrayim.

Not every yeshiva is corrupt.

Rav AK was right: fake frum values are preserving klal yisroel. Jews may not be honest or pure, but they look frum, which is all that really matters.

On Black Friday, we are selling charm.

- al tig'u b'mishichai -- elu tinnokos shel bais rabban.

Friday, November 25, 2005 9:56:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

We should makir tov to america.
And false frumkeit is wrong.Any
devil can buy a hat with his tzizith out and hes frum. Thats not what torah is about. THe outside is fine if it matches the inside. Perhapes this is the reason kids are going off, they see the hypocrisy.As long as i look the part, im frum. FALSE.And G-d doesn't need out fake service, perhapes he wants our hearts and actions.Black hat, blue hat,straw
hat....its all false service if our hearts aren't in tune with torah morality.Even very nice young girls fall into bums because the bums know how to dress the part.I totally disagree with the premise that false frumkeit is our
panacea in america. I believe its the cause of our problems.

Friday, November 25, 2005 2:19:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Waking up every day in the U.S.A. is like winning the lottery, Super Ball, Power Ball.....
90% of the world lives under tyranny and in fear of their very lives.
If you don't like this country, or refuse to show hakoros hatov, GET THE HELL OUT...
Go ahead, move to Israel or France....go ahead you unbelievable ingrates.

Friday, November 25, 2005 3:30:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

UOJ-enjoy mitzva night

Friday, November 25, 2005 3:38:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Above Anonymous:

You're real funny. Clearly you're a
loser single (and presumably a virgin.) No one else would say something so stupid. Enjoy your Shabbos session of self gratification tonight. Oh, and don't envision your mother again - it's just wrong.

Friday, November 25, 2005 3:54:00 PM  
Anonymous the booger said...

UO;

Right on. The boyz in da hood want to make you an honorary 'bro!

Keep on truckin.

Saturday, November 26, 2005 7:00:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

God ! I have spent hours now reading about so much rampant corruption in the "frum" community.

Heres just one little thing that came to me as a shock.

http://lukeford.net/profiles/profiles/yaakov_menken.htm


One of his victims apparently ayoung innocent Bais Yaakov girl ran a blog which she called thebeachofyellow.blogspot.com

This blog is not there anymore. Why is that?

Saturday, November 26, 2005 8:48:00 PM  
Blogger Ha-historion said...

UOJ is there any way I can contact you. I have a list here of lowlife corrupt criminals with shtreimesn and bekeshes who NEED TO BE EXPOSED!

by THE WAY did you write anything about the scandal with SPINKA yeshiva in Boro park and how they laundered money for corrupt Sharon and Co.

Its unfuckingbelievable these hungarian lowlife scum. How they stab good Jews int he back.

I will send you the info if you so request.

Much success on your endevaours.

Saturday, November 26, 2005 8:50:00 PM  
Blogger Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Steven,
E-mail me at a_unorthodoxjew@yahoo.com

Thanks.

Saturday, November 26, 2005 9:58:00 PM  
Anonymous gross said...

The Spinka Yeshiva f**ked over someone very close to me. I have no interest in discussing the details but they will surely burn in hell.

Saturday, November 26, 2005 11:22:00 PM  
Blogger Mortgage Center said...

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I have a mortgage calc site/blog. It pretty much covers mortgage calc related stuff.

Come and check it out if you get time :-)

Saturday, December 24, 2005 4:06:00 AM  

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